Yes

Yes, you can. But be very sure that it's actually empty, if you're not sure how to check - hire an electrician to check.

Generally, I don’t think running low voltage yourself is against code anywhere if that’s what you’re asking.

If you’re asking more “how” and you think the conduit goes from one room to another, get some pull string or fishing line and tie a balled up grocery bag to it and stuff it in one end. Use a vacuum in the other end to get the pull string through. Tie/tape your Ethernet cable to it and pull it back through. If you have fish tape, you can rub that through instead

You might need to rent or buy a fish tape but yes that sounds fine

You are going to need a fish tape to pull the wire through the conduit.

also, do I just buy about a 30meter ethernet cable from amazon to run through the conduit or is there a special kind I need?

If there’s indeed conduit already run, that’ll be a hell of a lot easier. But if it has lots of twists and turns, that’ll complicate things (unless the conduit already has something in it). Remember you only have so much control when feeding a wire to encourage it to turn at a junction—even the pro’s will deal with the same limitations of physics. Maybe there’s a world where you can run the cable through the conduit with some powerful magnets?

You could just buy powerline adapters.

In general, I don't run pre-terminated Ethernet. I find it far far easier to pull it and then terminate it myself. You can find spools of it on Amazon, and then you'd need to buy the proper tools to terminate (about $100-150 investment including a bigger spool). You can try buying a premade cable and pulling it with a fish tape and line, but depending on the size of the conduit you may get stuck.

Do you know if it's a dedicated line from your data closet? If so & the conduit is empty tie off a pull string to your cable so you can pull a 2nd line later in life assuming it's big enough.

Make sure the empty conduit isn’t a vent pipe for your plumbing.

It's fine to do, sure, but could get complicated with a long run and one that has bends and curves. Hopefully, they left a cord in the conduit to tie a future cable to and pull through.

You could probably run Ethernet w/o conduit. I dont think it carries a strong enough electrical current to be a fire hazard in the walls.

Electrician trick for wiring into pipes (don't get me in trouble with electricians by sharing) tie a long strong string into a wad of tissue paper roughly the size of the pipe. Stuff the wad I to the end with the string tid on your end. Then put an air compressor on the end and seal it enough so the air blows the string down through the pipe with the paper. Then tie your cable to the string and pull it back through the pipe.

Electrician said he pulled a 2 mike wire through a pipe like this.

And at that point you'd be better off asking them to run it since you're paying for the time anyway

As long as it won't cause interference with something else (such as if the conduit was a vent) then sure. You don't need an electrician for that.

How you physically do it will depend on your house.

Do make sure that you don't make your cable TOO long, especially if you care about fast links (10Gbps, though 1Gbps and 100Mbps can be affected too).

You can but I would attempted to avoid using male ends as the little retaining clips tend to get broken. If both sides have a conduit box get female ends.

Go to your local computer shop they should be able to sell you bulk cable pretty cheap then grab female ends and face plates.

If you want to run it with the male end attached look at getting something like these guys. It will keep your install looking nice and clean.

https://www.amazon.ca/HuaHengHT-Ethernet-Network-Keystone-Coupler/dp/B099SGQWTP/

Works the other way too with a vacuum cleaner, but you're pulling rather than pushing

Although when you are talking "too long" here you mean WAY too long. Like an extra unnecessary 40 feet. Having an extra 4 feet is no issue.

For vacuum I always want short fat pipes, for long pipes pressure works better, because air is stretchy.

MoCA is better imho if you have coax cable in the house and access to change any splitters.

A good quality cable can carry 1Gbps over some 80-100 meters. Splice it and you reduce the maximum significantly (as low as 20 meters before it slows down and maybe 40-50 meters before it fails completely)

i didnt think about the vacuum idea. impressive.

Just dont exceed 100 meters.

Or just get a fish tape tool, which is literally designed for this purpose. this

Use this method at work all the time. Works like a charm.

Agreed, though I will say to date I've never had 1GbE impacted significantly by length and I've surpassed the max many times. Definitely depends on the existing environment.

Why not look into Powerline adapters? They aren't the fastest compared to the best ethernet or wifi, but a good pair of powerline adapters will give you close to 100mbps depending on how good the wiring in the house is.

I had this problem when setting up an office above the garage and bought an older version of these: [TP Link Powerline Adapters] (https://www.amazon.com/TP-Link-AV1000-Powerline-Ethernet-Adapter/dp/B08M13B8B6/) and it worked pretty well. Might save you from dealing with the wires.

It's pretty tough to make an ethernet run TOO long in a normal residential application. Even Cat5e max recommendation is 100 meters with about 5ns propagation loss per meter. Even in a very large home, 30m or so is about as long as you would typically see.

If you prevent external interference in some other way you can break the rule I guess.

Yeah you probably need some sort of yard and connecting buildings for that to matter.

The max for 10Gbps is probably shorter.

If you've got a vacuum on hand, might as well vacuum it instead of buying a fish stick you'll never use again. Vacuuming in lines is standard practice for long conduit runs, it'd be even easier here (although honestly if it's short with few bends you can just push it).

In this case, OP is going up 2 stories through a lot of bends, at that point they'll need a full fishtape, not sticks.

The problem with this run is it's probably emt with set screw connectors, which will lose vacuum. I'd try the vacuum route, then buy a fish tape and return it.

Hopefully your vent pipe doesn't terminate in a wall box.

I did mention using fish tape. However, if you don’t have one and probably won’t be pulling cables again it’s kind of a waste of time and money to go buy one if you can rig something else together.

I didn't even realize you could splice cat6

That doesnt really make sense to me, could you explain?

Clever. Thanks for the tip to both push and pull techniques.

Its actually the same 100m recommendation, just with Cat6a.

>male ends as the little retaining clips tend to get broken

If you have to pull a preterminated cable, it can be really helpful to tape those down.

In my house everything is twisted pair (up to the GPON). I've seen some splicing done because we wouldn't redo the wiring, and it was fine (15 meters or so, 100Mbps). Now I have proper unspliced Gigabit links.

Hey, if you decide to buy a fish tape and try this do not get a metal one. Fiberglass only. Unless you're absolutely sure where it goes, you may wind up pushing a fish tape directly into your panel, and if you're pushing a metal one you're liable to get hurt. And unless you can visually or physically verify it's the same conduit, you shouldn't be sure where it goes.

Generally I'd say hire an electrician, but I'm an electrician, so I'm biased. Right now, if that conduit isn't connected to your electrical system in any way, it's just a pipe in your walls, nothing special about it. The problem is confirming that. Frankly, I'm not recommending you shove even a fiberglass fish tape through, just saying if you decide to push something down an unverified conduit, make sure it isn't conductive.

Wow I really like the grocery bag idea. Thank you.

And the quality of the cable as well.

You can splice basically any cable. The splice WILL negatively affect the signal so it's a game of whether you can afford that

Could I do it? Yes, absolutely.

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Could you do it? Sounds iffy since you are asking this question to Reddit.

​

If you can get a pull rope through it, then yes it should be easy. Start with using some nylon string (it needs to be strong) and tie a paper towel or tissue to the end of it. Use a vacuum cleaner and suck one end of the pipe while someone else feeds in the tissue and string. Be careful not to overshoot since you will be vacuuming up a bunch of string and that won't be good. Next use electrical tape to connect the wire to the string and see if it will pull in. Terminate the ends, and you're done.

Have you ever heard the term "thin air"? When you pull on air it stretches. The more air between you and what you want to pull the more space air has to stretch, and the more air there is to stretch. This overworks your vacuum. The longer the pipe, the less efficient the vacuum is. The air has friction against the surface area of the pipe and adds drag which stretches the air thin.

I have combined the vacuum with a compressed air nozzle on the other end to supercharge the pull on PITA runs. Works great with masons line and then you can pull in a heftier string or the wire directly depending on the situation.

You most certainly can run Ethernet through conduit. We do it in the trades regularly. However, I will recommend that you don’t run electric and Ethernet through the same conduit as that will cause interference with your Ethernet cable and more than likely make your connection wonky.

when we run Ethernet cable, we zip tie it to the conduit and then have the Ethernet cable go into the box through a romex connector or through a plastic bushing/connector specially made for Ethernet cables. Pm me for pictures if you have any questions. Good luck!

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You absolutely can however if you have empty conduit already in the wall going where you want it, it will be much easier to run it through that.

Another trick is to use an air compressor. As long as the path has only one way for the air to escape, the string will completely follow the air path to that exit. So you may need to tape up any spots that you don't want the string to follow.

It will make some crazy zig zaggy paths (if needed) to reach the end. But it works.

OP could shut off the main breaker at the box I'd think? (I only have metal tapes, but I use them more for running cat 5 without conduit).

Vacuums with a mouse...? Nozzle autocorrect? Or exciting new terminology to learn??

You never know, that could come in handy.... /s

Won’t help if your metal fish tape pops out and into the supply lugs of the main breaker.

You don't need to run Ethernet through a conduit, you don't need an electrician to run low voltage.

As long as you're fine with patching up whatever holes you make and you don't do something surprisingly dumb, it's an easy DIY.

I have read most of the answers here and this is how I think you should do this. Not sure what you mean by "open the outlet for that" but I am going to assume you mean a cover plate. You would need a vacuum cleaner where you can move the hose to blow air. Have a friend at one end blow air and you can test if the air is coming through the conduit where you think it should come out. If that works, make a "mouse out of a small wad of crumpled paper, tie it with light string - like cheap kite string and use the vacuum to pull it through the conduit. Use this string to pull a heavier string through until you have a pull rope that will be strong enough to pull your cable. It will probably be easiest to pull from the basement as gravity will be working with you instead of against you, however if the vacuum fits better at the other end use that for string, then you can pull cable either way. Bob's your uncle!

brilliant

And if it’s preterminated, you’re going to need a bigger conduit.

A mouse is what you tie to the end of the jetline, to pull the string through the pipe with the vacuum. But more realistically, your apprentice loses the mouse on the first pull and you use the corner of a glad bag from there on out.

A "mouse" is a foam plug the diameter of the conduit it is intended for. Tie string on and suck thru with vacuum.

Conduit normally isn't 1-1/4" or greater in size...

If his house is big enough to need a 100m conduit then he can afford to hire an electrician 😁

You could probably run Ethernet w/o conduit. It doesn't carry enough electrical current to be a fire hazard in the walls.

We use tools to help us pull wire/cable in conduit. The one that would be applicable here would be a steel fish-tape. Something like this, of a sufficient length, would be appropriate: https://www.kleintools.com/catalog/fish-tapes/steel-fish-tape-18-inch-x-50-foot

u/VanillianArt tagging you here so you see it. If you’re going to go this route, PLEASE verify that the conduit doesn’t terminate into an electrical panel. If it does, and the conduit is appropriately grounded the way it should be, you aren’t in much physical danger. However, the fish tape will probably explode inside the panel, causing far more extensive AND expensive repairs than just getting a professional to do the work from the get go.

If the conduit isn’t properly grounded and does terminate into a panel, or is non-metallic (PVC, for instance,) then it the fish tape will essentially turn into an uninsulated wire that you’re holding on to. Definitely not a good time.

One way of checking would be to get a shop vacuum and run it “in reverse” (blow mode) and put it up against the junction box. Go over to the panel, and if you have air coming out of a conduit, it’s a no-go.

I think you’ll probably find that the conduit goes to the panel. Residential electrical doesn’t tend to use conduit for very much at all, except when it’s absolutely required. It would be cheaper and faster to install for the contractor to have just ran plenum-rated Cat5/6/etc cable than to have ran conduit for it. It seems pretty unlikely that they ran spare, future conduits in anything other than a custom home. From my experience building custom homes.

Edit: also, if it’s at all possible, I would recommend completely removing power from the panel in question before removing the cover, and only restoring power after the cover has been replaced. Otherwise, something could go horribly wrong. Even as a professional, taking a dead front off of a live residential panel can be a bit nerve wracking.

Edit 2: a word, for clarity

Source: former electrician of 9 years, with residential, commercial, and industrial experience.

I just used a Powerline network adapter kit. That runs through the electrical outlets. I put one in the room where my router is and the other one in my living room to feed my entertainment system. I have a switch in the living room and it is attached to all of the devices including a wireless access point for better wifi signal out there. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01929ESG6/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Sometimes they work great - in my case they do.

What if there is already another cable in the pipe? Will the vacuum/compressed air methods still work?

Use plenum rated cable. Resists fire and doesn't release "as toxic" of fumes as regular cable.

If it helps, water in a tube can only be 'vacuumed' up 10.3 meters before a literal vacuum is created. Whereas the distance water can be pushed vertically through the same tube is only limited by the pressure pushing the water. The more pressure, the higher the water goes.

It will if they have a disconnect before the panel. That’s how I wired my parents home up, so that they could easily and safely work inside of their main panel if necessary.

Brilliant! Thank you.

What the other guy said. The main breaker shuts off everything downstream, but everything upstream of the main breaker in the panel is hot (ie the lugs). And they're pretty easy to hit. You'd have to pull the meter to fully deenergize the enclosure, and that's a pain in the ass to deal with. Generally, you need to call the utility, although you can always break that rule, but pulling meters isn't something I'd recommend to a DIYer because depending on the state of the meter base, there's serious risk of pulling a lug off and arcing it to the can.

My advice in another comment was to take a shop-vac and run it as a blower, then stick the hose onto the conduit/h-box. Have someone else with the panel cover off listening/feeling for air coming out of any conduit.

This is a concerning one for me though. Removing/replacing the cover could be problematic. It’s residential, and I see spare data conduits being left by contractors as… a dubious event. At least outside the context of custom homes.

When you feel wind, that air is pushing on you and compresses a bit against you. Air can stretch and thin out, or it can compress and push.

While it's certainly possible, an important factor is the type of conduit and internal diameter. Is is blue with ridges (smurf tube) and meant for low volt? Is it grey PVC or metal conduit meant for electrical runs? Or is it white PVC meant for an in wall vacuum?

Where is the other end?

Smurf tubes will often be a straight run with no interruptions.

Electrical conduit will require an access point every 360° or less. Electrical conduit also often runs to other j-boxes in other rooms.

Vacuum runs will be run like plumbing drains and have branches that lead to a central trunk.

They type of conduit can help determine the best method of running ethernet cable, whether vacuum, compressor or fish. A picture would help.

When that happens I usually fashion a tiny parachute and attach it to the string, then vacuum. The parachute can bounce around in the diameter of the tube a bit better so is less likely to get snagged on the existing wire as it gets pulled through.

btw the air compressor/vacuum method is called Pigging(using a Pipe Pig) vs Fishing.

You don't need conduit, although if you're running it through something like a cold air return I believe you need Plenum rated cable. For both my current and previous house I used existing in-wall runs of coaxial and/or telephone lines to run ethernet. Just pulled the cover off, cut the cable, taped the ethernet to it and went into the basement to pull it through. Mind you, I didn't have a lot of bends to deal with, and we ditched landline and cable years ago so we didn't care about the existing lines.

This is the real tip, I've even seen electricians almost kill themselves with metal fish tape!!!

The only problem with powerline is what you mentioned....depends a lot on the existing wiring. Older houses have bigger issues with this than newer ones.

Probably not an issue if you are running it through conduit as a homeowner, but in general it's a good idea to run plenum grade Ethernet cable if it's going through the walls or attic. Plenum grade cable is more fire resistant and may be required to meet some types of code. The downside is that it tends to be a bit more expensive and is usually stiffer which can make it harder to work with.

i recently completed an in-home ethernet installation retrofit in my own house doing this so it's totally fine. as for "how" a lot of people have explained the vacuum trick. i will say that if your line gets stuck, as mine did. you may have to unscrew the rigid conduit from the straps and do some manual pulling if there are a lot of bends.

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The difference in pressure on the 2 sides of the wad is what pushes it.

If you use a vacuum, your high pressure side is roughly 15 psi and the other is maybe 0 (probably more, but whatever). So the max difference is 15 psi.

If you use pressure, the low pressure side is 15 psi, but the high side can now be whatever your compressor gives. Maybe 90 psi or more. So the pressure difference is much higher.

When pushing long distances where there will be more drag due to the line being pulled, the higher pressure difference will help more.

While the air is "stretchy," that's not really what matters.

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Running high voltage isn't against code either.

The only question is permitting / code requirements and AFAIK there really aren't any for low voltage other than really really obvious things like "dont run non-plenum cable through plenums."

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Fair point, I am an hvac guy so Intake=short, fat, output= long pipe

I thought in some localities you could not run high voltage without a permit, people still do of course.

plastic

Okay now this makes sense to me

Yes this does help, thanks

This makes some sense, and plays into the pressure differential example the other commenters gave, thanks for taking the time!

Never heard it called that and I've been in the trade a while, but every area has its own trade terminology

Homeowners can get a permit and do it themselves AFAIK. You do need to abide by code requirements.

Just thought I would throw it out there.Sometimes people get creative and underestimate how much length they have added.

I agree, but it would be something I would try out before I tried buying a fish tape and running a line through an unknown conduit. Worst case it doesn't work and gets returned.

I've watched wiring/fiber contractors do this a few times.

These are really good points; I guess I was just assuming OP already knew it was an empty conduit for Ethernet/speaker/etc wire, instead of something that might terminate at the label. Smart to check beforehand!

Also, I’m just a DIYer so I’m not aware of all the specific tools, I have used fish tape in the past and have a set of fish rods I use for installing new outlets at my home, but if the conduit behind the wall twists and turns many times, would fish tape still be indicated? Would it be able to, say, fish a wire through multiple right angles? I’ve never done it, I’m just curious. I suggested the magnets because I saw a video online of someone hooking up a cheap magnet to (unpowered) romex and then using a powerful magnet on the outside of the wall to magnetically “drag” the cable inside the wall downward. I figured you could perhaps do roughly the same with turns if needing to move laterally.

I used fish tape to run a wire across an office building with ceiling tiles, and I ran it over the ceiling tiles.

Well there all kinds of suspension stuff, other wires, ducts and shit up the wire zigged and zagged through because it’s hard to aim those suckers, I probably used 30-40% more wire than needed but it was a fun job nonetheless.

Yeah. My trick only works when you can use air pressure and control the openings of a volume. Drop ceilings are another matter entirely.

Yeah, fish tape is flexible, yet stiff enough that it should be able to make it through multiple bends. Additionally - at least in the US - code requires there be no more than 360 degrees of bend in conduit between boxes. For exactly the purpose of being able to pull wire through it. It gets to be exceptionally difficult to pull wire past anything more than 360.

Anything more than that, and the original installer hated everyone else anyway. I’ve seen examples of what you saw in that video. Works awesome inside a wall with no insulation in the cavity. Works much less well when there’s insulation involved. And the amount of friction that’s inside of a conduit would almost certainly overwhelm the holding power of the magnet. Also, if it’s steel conduit (EMT, IMC, or rigid,) the conduit itself would also get magnetized.

You sure know your stuff! Thanks for indulging. I’ve vastly enjoyed running my wires through interior partition walls way more than my exterior walls with insulation (and blocking in one case! That was a nightmare!). I’ve just never run with conduit so wasn’t too sure about all the particulars. Who knows how OP’s conduit was installed but these are all great considerations to take into account.