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alcatrazcgp t1_j1z0scs wrote

Reply to comment by ----Zenith---- in 11 years ago Michio Kaku talked about mind upload into Machine - Big Think by keghi11

the best way to achieve "immortality" is keeping yourself alive, or at the very least transplanting your entire brain. which is in this case "you".

no brain = no you

you = specific signals in the brain

you can't just move that in code form onto a machine, thankfully im not the only one who realized this

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FrmrPresJamesTaylor t1_j20lcd9 wrote

Honestly I would love to see a bunch of billionaires and influential technophiles essentially sign up for their own deaths in this manner. If someone thinks this technology is desireable or even possible, they can go first.

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alcatrazcgp t1_j20lwm8 wrote

that actually seems like the worst "shortcut" for immortality, once these billionaires get it, who is to say you cant just turn off their copies? its just lines of codes, its not a living human, its a copy of them.

now if you took the route of biology and bioengineering and prolong your existing life by many different ways, thats a whole different story, thats true immortality

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thisimpetus t1_j24pn4w wrote

> you can't just move that into code form onto a machine

That's an absolutely enormous claim I will be utterly shocked if you could truly defend, and that's not to insult you but to suggest that you might vastly underestimate the scale of that claim. It is absolutely not something that can be taken as obvious.

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alcatrazcgp t1_j24qnyh wrote

No, I do not underestimate it, I truly think its impossible, at least for a very very long time. while you can copy it, you can't MOVE it, moving it would mean you somehow, some way, transform my brain into code while not killing me in the process, and then putting that into a machine, again, without killing me.

you can easily scan the brain and its signals and just translate that into code and input that into a machine yes, but you can't move the brain and "me" into that machine, you can just input a copy of me in it. hope that makes sense

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thisimpetus t1_j24roa0 wrote

Well "moving it" isn't a meaningful thing to say, there is nothing to move, structure and data aren't material things. You're literally constantly changing, there is nothing static about you. You are the information in motion; where it is and by what means it moves doesn't mean anything. Copying a PDF doesn't physically relocate parts of your drive to another location, it represents that information identically somewhere else. So too your consciousness; just as reading the same song from different devices changes absolutely nothing about the song—and just as a song has to be happening in time to actually be the song—what makes you you is the data structure connected in real time to the environment, not the medium.

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alcatrazcgp t1_j24uot7 wrote

no, your consciousness is not the same as digital data, you cannot have 2 copies at the same time, you can only control one, you cannot control 2 different "you"s in different places, thats not how it works

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thisimpetus t1_j24vor3 wrote

Well, I'm no expert in this field but I do have a little academic training in it and I'll tell you that these claims you're making are very, very big claims that a great many PhD's have debated and I think if you're really interested in this subject you might consider getting into some of the reading.

Because the thing is, I don't think you'll find much agreement with your position at the top of the game, but that's because these are really, really hard questions and our intuitions about them tend to be really bad. That makes a lot of sense; we certainly can't expect ourselves to have an evolved understanding of these ideas. But all the same, if you're really interested, there are some fundamental ideas that you're challenging and I'd wager you might reconsider some of them if you got some exposure to some rigorous investigation of them. It's very interesting stuff, I know my thinking was forever changed by it. D.C. Dennet is a great place to start because his writing is enjoyable in addition to being top-shelf cognitive philosophy.

Best.

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Stainless_Heart t1_j23n9hs wrote

Tell me, exactly which signals are constant, uninterrupted, and represent you as a person?

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alcatrazcgp t1_j23nqcv wrote

all of them

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Stainless_Heart t1_j23nzah wrote

Are they all permanent signals? Or do they come and go, regenerated when needed?

If the latter, you’re constantly dying in little bits and being recreated in little bits.

If the former, if all your brain signals were always happening without cessation… you’d be insane or at least in full seizure.

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