Comments
atreides4242 t1_ixcqvti wrote
What is the average cost of a meal at one of these restaurants?
Metalytiq OP t1_ixcso7e wrote
The Michelin Guide publishes both countries together under the Great Britain and Ireland Guide
11160704 t1_ixcss4o wrote
A bit sad for Ireland.
IllRoad1059 t1_ixctggz wrote
Exactly maybe you can lump together China and Japan too.
Metalytiq OP t1_ixctr80 wrote
That would be an interesting data element for us to factor in. Thanks for the idea!
drinkduffdry t1_ixcyjft wrote
Seems like a couple massive corrections Fr v Ja
MarinaDelRey1 t1_ixd04xr wrote
Would it be possible to break out the three major US cities? Would be interested to see how that changed over time. I also think they added LA recently
Greedy-Knowledge6043 t1_ixd1g2o wrote
Never dined at one, but last I checked it's roughly $200-$300 per head. Could be significantly more depending on the place.
Greedy-Knowledge6043 t1_ixd1tqo wrote
It would be interesting to see the same for 1 and 2 star restaurants. Michelin have been handing out stars like candy in Asia to bolster their own relevance there.
In the old school world of gastronomy, it would take years if not a decade or more to get 3 stars in France or UK. These days it's not unheard of for a restaurant in Singapore or Japan to open with 2 stars in the first year. Understandable why Michelin do this but is also cheapens the ratings. I'd still trust the Michelin guide in Europe, but not in Asia.
SnooPies7876 t1_ixd3hsf wrote
Lmao not a single Canadian restaurant
InsuranceToTheRescue t1_ixd4u7k wrote
I will never have the money for it, but it's been on my bucket list to have dinner at a 3 starred restaurant. Closest I've got is going to a Ruth's Chris Steak House. Sure it's on the fancier side, but it's still a chain.
Metalytiq OP t1_ixd7jne wrote
Agree that Michelin has brought down the value of the one and two star rating by awarding so many restaurants. Originally we wanted to include the one and two star restaurant counts but the data was difficult to find. We worked closely with Andy Hayler, who is a Michelin historian and he may have enough data to do a future visualization to include and one/two star restaurants.
Metalytiq OP t1_ixd7q5v wrote
A similar visualization of just US cities would be interesting. We will take a look. Thanks for the idea!
sveme t1_ixd7tzh wrote
The Tantris in Munich, which is a world-famous 2-star restaurant, has an offer with eight dishes costing 325€ per person (without wine). If you want to get the wine as well, that's another 185€.
MarinaDelRey1 t1_ixd88uq wrote
Or just cities generally. Thanks!
Yossarian216 t1_ixd8pos wrote
Last I looked in the US all but two were in NYC or California, predominantly Bay Area. There’s one in Chicago, and one about 90 minutes outside of DC near Shenandoah National Park.
[deleted] t1_ixdbq13 wrote
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MarinaDelRey1 t1_ixdbrou wrote
I know Alinea has had one for awhile but I thought Charlie Trotters had one when it was open. Might need to expand the dataset to ** and * for it to be meaningful though
iamamuttonhead t1_ixdeu8n wrote
The "fancy" part is not nearly as important as the "food" part. You likely could go to a restaurant with more interesting food for less money than you spent at Ruth's Chris Steak House.
pixelburger t1_ixdfyks wrote
Esquire Magazine once did a survey of the best restaurants in the U.S., explaining at the outset that New York was left out because it would have totally dominated the results
MarinaDelRey1 t1_ixdgtft wrote
That’s why I think it’s be interesting to see by city over time. I’m pretty sure SF and Chicago made significant gains on NYC in terms of Michelin stars over the past few years
pixelburger t1_ixdhh6n wrote
Why are you sure of that?
MarinaDelRey1 t1_ixdjd4v wrote
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Dr_Catfish t1_ixdqiyo wrote
Have y'all ever seen a Michelin 3 star?
Pay 5000 USD or equivalent for some flavoured fucking smoke.
"Cuisine"
This just shows me where the most overpriced garbage is centralized.
welkinator t1_ixdtdmq wrote
I find it interesting that the number in any given country can decrease from one year to another. That brings up the question: does Michelin remove restaurants year to year also?
Yossarian216 t1_ixdueap wrote
Alinea is the only current three star in Chicago, there are a number of one and two stars as well though.
DeadFyre t1_ixdvdzf wrote
For a two-star restaurant, you're looking at an average of $250 per diner for the tasting menu, for a three-star restaurant, $350 per diner for the tasting menu. Beverages are usually separate, with wine pairings, you can definitely get north of $500 per diner.
DeadFyre t1_ixdw15t wrote
Speaking as someone who's been to a few Michelin star places, as well as more that aspire to be, while they're definitely an extravagant exerise, you on no account need to visit one of these venues for great food. The places which get michelin stars are as much about presentation and service as it is about the food. Make no mistake, the food is good, even great, but you can get great food for less.
muftu t1_ixe12d1 wrote
Nope, Michelin is a french company that created a guide based on french cuisine. So it makes sense that french do french cuisine well.
Shiningc t1_ixe2hzz wrote
There might be some bias but it’s not just French cuisine.
muftu t1_ixe2ptc wrote
No, but most of the criteria fit french food very well. If you look at the restaurants in Japan as an example, a lot of them are french.
SailSignificant5812 t1_ixe595q wrote
I would do it on a vacation in a poorer country if possible. Was in one 1 star in Poland and it was really not that expensive I think 50 Euro pp.
Salty-Article3888 t1_ixe6bdv wrote
$85-500. You can get a good starred meal for $125 pretty consistently. The really crazy places are $300-500. But it’s also not a ripoff at the legit places. Food cost is around 25-30%
piassepaspiece t1_ixe9z4i wrote
Because Michelin does not review every country nor city. They started doing Toronto only this year. (Unsurprisingly, it's basically a guide to high end Japanese restaurants, with 2-3 French/Italian restaurants.)
SnooPies7876 t1_ixea2vl wrote
Well that makes me feel better about our Canadian cuisine! Haha I didn't realize that, thank you!
targert_mathos t1_ixea92m wrote
$5000? Flavored smoke?
Have YOU ever seen a 3 star restaurant? The answer very clearly is a no.
BadgersOrifice t1_ixebkio wrote
Don't think we have any 3* restaurants anyway so ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Konexian t1_ixeeg31 wrote
To be fair, I went to Bo Innovation in Hong Kong where I was given meat flavored toothpicks and was asked to "suck the toothpick while imagining the taste of wild duck". Probably one of the most ridiculous meal I've ever had. I went when they were 3 stars - they've been deservedly demoted to 2 stars since.
BronChalton t1_ixei4jf wrote
I've been to 1 3-starred restaurant. Alinea, in Chicago. Cost me a bit over $400, including gratuity.
It was amazing. The food was delicious, but when I describe it to people I try to paint it more as an experience than a meal. Compared the cost to going to Disneyland rather than eating at a restaurant.
If I had the money I would love to do it again in a few years.
[deleted] t1_ixenfeh wrote
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Dr_Catfish t1_ixepn9y wrote
Hrng, pay hundreds or thousands to eat food off a table.
Hrng, thousands more for a 27 course meal that includes a normal orange, citrus foam in a cast of the chefs mouth and a fish wafer cracker.
Down vote me all you want but your shitty "high quality cuisine" and "fine dining experience" is a waste of time, resources and money.
LucasPisaCielo t1_ixeqclu wrote
How would you recommend to find such places?
irewestlad t1_ixeqm6a wrote
Why is UK and Ireland grouped together? Why not just group somewhere like Belgium and Netherlands together we’re going to group independent countries
Metalytiq OP t1_ixer7py wrote
Michelin groups the two countries under the same Michelin Guide UK & Ireland edition.
dorkyromantic t1_ixesa86 wrote
Yes — restaurants can lose stars
prylosec t1_ixeths7 wrote
It's incredibly difficult to maintain the standards needed to make these lists, so it's entirely possible for a restaurant to be listed one year and not another if there is a dip in quality. Restaurants also tend close seemingly out of nowhere and can for any reason, and top-tier restaurants like this are no exception.
irewestlad t1_ixeu3lh wrote
Thanks for the reply, I didn’t realise
targert_mathos t1_ixewmwy wrote
You can make the dumbed down money argument for literally everything. Pay 10s of thousands more to drive the same box with wheels with a different logo. Pay hundreds more to watch the same thing on a bigger screen. Pay hundreds more to wear a different leather on your feet. Etc etc.
Nobody is forcing you to go to any restaurant if you don't want to. If people do and they enjoy it, which the vast majority does, then just let them be.
Llanite t1_ixewr31 wrote
Why? You need to apply for different visa and can't go to one from another 🤦♂️
TheVizualizer t1_ixeyitc wrote
Wouldn't that look a bit messy with over 20 lines representing each country over 15 years?
Due-Piccolo-8171 t1_ixf2x43 wrote
What happened between 2011-2013 in japan? They Went up about 20 restaurants then went down 10
AndyVale t1_ixf41cn wrote
Okay, if we're talking sit-down restaurants more than fast food joints I usually do a mix of the following:
- Travel books (I get one of those little guide books for most major cities I plan to visit)
- Food blogs, just Google some local ones
- Searching Instagram hashtags
- TripAdvisor
If I'm seeing a place getting good reviews on all the above, and it sounds up my street, then I'd give it a go.
I'd also say that the Michelin Guide does have cheaper options than 3*
A 1* meal may still be the best meal you've had in your life, made by some outstanding chefs. Unlikely to be CHEAP, but in my experience they're cheaper than 3* ones. For example, the tasting menu at the 1* I went to this evening was about £140, while the one at the 2* place I nearly went to comes to about £320.
They also have non-starred restaurants in the Michelin guide too. Again, these are usually still very good. They tend to be a tad less extravagant, the experience might not be as polished, but I've rarely been let down. For clarity, I've been to a couple over the last few days and the price has come to about £50-90 a head, easily could have done them for less too.
They also have the 'Bib Gourmand' rating, which specifically means you can get a meal for a cheaper price (the threshold varies by area, and it may still be more expensive than a casual chain).
AndyVale t1_ixf4n6w wrote
Their official criteria are:
- Quality of ingredients
- Mastery of flavours & techniques
- The personality of the chef in their cuisine
- Value for money**
- Consistency between visits
But yeah, the service and 'experience' are generally at a high level even if they don't directly impact those criteria.
**How can you have value for money when it's so expensive?
A few months back Clare Smyth (Head Chef at Core, a 3* restaurant in London) was on Desert Island Discs, where the topic of fine dining prices was raised.
She is asked about the price of fine dining (£195+ tasting menu at Core). Does she have any qualms about the cost during a cost of living crisis?
Here answer, paraphrased, was "No. We have seats for 54 paying customers, who will be served by 57 members of staff. And those staff are the absolute top of their game. Also, the ingredients we use are the finest too and we pay a fair price for them. It's actually quite good value for money, you would pay double that for a similar experience in Paris."
Now, someone may still sit there and think "not value for me", and that's fine. But when you start exploring all the little things that make a place like that tick you do see how a lot more is needed to keep it going.
chetanaik t1_ixf5o2d wrote
Fine, just to cheer you up, the "Great Britain and Awesome Ireland Guide"
TrumpTheLeftist t1_ixf67du wrote
Why it went so fast up idk, but Japan lost a lot of stars one year because it was almost impossible for «normal» people to book in a lot of the high end restaurants. You either had to live in some of the most expensive hotels and they would make the reservations for you or had to have connections or some celebrity status. Michelin guide dont want to create that kind of elitistic environment.
AndyVale t1_ixf7r8m wrote
Yeah, I sometimes get people saying you could buy 100 Big Macs or whatever for that price when discussing fine dining restaurants, and I don't dispute it.
Sure, if that's your thing then go for it.
But one or two people with minimal training could probably make and serve those Big Macs in brown paper bags in an hour or two. They'll be made with cheap ingredients, they'll be the same as the ones you could buy a few miles further down the road, and they'll do their job of giving you tasty calories with minimal fuss just fine.
A 9-course tasting menu at a 3* place will be designed by one of the best foodie visionaries on the planet, made by a team of highly trained chefs, using the best quality ingredients, creatively presented, expertly paired with independently produced drinks, served with a flourish by the most charming staff in the game, and all in a gorgeous/cool/iconic/historic setting.
As you say, it's a full experience.
lurker12346 t1_ixf80in wrote
lol the korean michelin restaurants are such dogshit, they just replate normal ass korean food
orrk256 t1_ixf8ypv wrote
Aqua in Wolfsburg is quite affordable
The_Falc0n t1_ixfdzcb wrote
Missing a /s ?
coodgee33 t1_ixffceg wrote
Different wanker critic had entirely different ideas of what's good or same wanker makes up new rules each year.
klaasvaak1214 t1_ixffi2q wrote
I went to a 1 star Michelin restaurant and ordered "Codfish filet au gratin in a soft cream sauce". What I got was a piece of cod in a bowl of milk and cornflakes. Similar to movies that are highly rated by the most discerning critics; they can be great for all people, but are sometimes mostly loved by critics seeking whatever criteria are popular in the communities of critics.
----___--___---- t1_ixfftz5 wrote
Anything from 150€ to 400€ is possible, though 200€ to 250€ is probably the most common price range.
Usually you can pay around 70% of what the food costs extra, to also get selected beverages served with your food (I just grabbed the 70% out of my ass, but it feels right).
If you want a whole bottle of wine or something like that, it can get very expensive very fast.
LucasPisaCielo t1_ixfmef4 wrote
Thank you for all this information. I've found out the travel books sometimes are outdated, but it's a great place to start. I'm going to use your other tips.
ryoma-gerald t1_ixfo50f wrote
I was expecting to see US higher in rank.
krectus t1_ixfobdr wrote
Yeah there system kinda sucks, they should just stick to tires.
MJTony t1_ixfqvap wrote
Vancouver last month
MJTony t1_ixfqxp2 wrote
Or starts, according to OP
retrovaporizer t1_ixftv39 wrote
there is absolutely zero chance of leaving hungry at one of these places. if anything its too much food and its getting a little ridiculous by the end.
mart1t1 t1_ixfvo8c wrote
It’s important to remember that prices changes heavily depending on the country you’re in. I found 2 star star michelin restaurant in France cheaper than the Norton
Intelligent_Spray951 t1_ixg0u7a wrote
Most of the ratings are derived from people sitting around going through restaurant sites, blog posts, etc. because Michelin Guides are always money losers and can’t afford the requisite army of inspectors. They are more interested in buzz than food. The World’s 50 Best Restaurants gives Michelin the willies.
Frank9567 t1_ixg2899 wrote
Can't do that with the UK and Ireland, either.
Metalytiq OP t1_ixg2oxo wrote
Good point. We are looking into doing a similar visualization with the Worlds Top 50 rankings. They have a better representation of all countries.
piassepaspiece t1_ixg6sub wrote
By this year, I meant in 2022. In Toronto it's two months old (September). So, it's not surprising that there are no three stars.
imk t1_ixgbwyt wrote
If you want the multiple Michelin star type of experience without all the cost, go to Lima Perú. 3 of the top 50 restaurants in the world are there. I ate at one (Central) and it was amazing. It isn’t cheap, but it is about half of what you would pay in Europe or the USA
AndyVale t1_ixgkw6a wrote
They can definitely get dated quickly in the restaurant scene. The same as Tripadvisor needs a bit of understanding to really get what you're looking for, the Michelin Guide can be late to the game, and a blog may be one person's individual taste.
But if something's hitting the right notes across a mix of them, you're likely going to be in the right ballpark.
Arioxel_ t1_ixgm30b wrote
At least 150$ per head. Few are cheaper, some are way more expensive.
dc456 t1_ixgphyp wrote
Also some of the things that Michelin looks for in French restaurants also naturally overlaps with Japanese ones. Like most Michelin star restaurants will serve smaller portions, neatly plated. That’s how many Japanese dishes are commonly served by default.
jaytee158 t1_ixh1w49 wrote
Yes these are the exact same things. I can't see how the two scenarios are possibly different
IllRoad1059 t1_ixhpvh4 wrote
That's my point!!! Ireland and UK are different countries. Ireland is an independent country it should not be with the UK
Metalytiq OP t1_ixcqhlq wrote
Data Source: www.andyhayler.com and www.guide.michelin.com
Tool: Tableau
For nearly 100 years, The Michelin Guide has awarded restaurants with one, two, and three stars. The three star accolade being considered the most prestigious for "exceptional cuisine, worth a special journey". In 2006, Michelin expanded its Guide to outside of Europe, with its publication of the New York City edition of the Guide. Today, the Michelin Guide publishes Guide’s across 41 countries, awarding over 3,000 restaurants with Michelin stars and only 139 restaurants earning the highly coveted three star award.
With the help of renowned food critic and freelance writer, Andy Hayler, we compiled the number of three star restaurants by country since 2007. Historically, France has held the top spot with the most three star awards, however, once countries outside of Europe were reviewed, Japan quickly soared as the world’s leader by 2011. Since then, France and Japan have gone back and forth as the leading country.
Notes:
Michelin began reviewing countries outside of Europe in 2006, however, due to data not being readily available, this visualization starts at 2007
The Michelin Guide for California was canceled in 2021 due to the pandemic. This resulted in the USA's count to drastically decrease for that year.