Comments

You must log in or register to comment.

9Wind t1_j28hcfx wrote

> The law dramatically expands the media regulator's powers and gives it the authority to shut down news sites that are not officially registered as media without a court ruling. 

> In July the European Federation of Journalists urged the Ukrainian authorities to withdraw the draft media law. The federation said that the law contained "many provisions that are contrary to European values."

That is yikes. Anyone that comes in later on could abuse that.

43

Wookhooves t1_j28i78l wrote

Between jailing his opponents and silencing media this doesn’t look great…

−48

Freexscsa t1_j28ib56 wrote

President Volodymyr Zelensky on Dec. 29 signed into law a controversial bill on the media.

The Ukrainian authorities argued that the law aims to bring Ukrainian legislation in line with EU law and fight Russian propaganda.

Media reform is one of the EU's conditions for starting negotiations on Ukraine's accession to the bloc. The EU wanted Ukraine to adopt legislation to fight the influence of vested interests on the media.

152

tetoffens t1_j28m79b wrote

Replying to AudibleNod (#1,178,824)

Attributing it to the paper itself rather than a person usually means it is the official stance of the publication, not that someone is afraid to attach their name.

But I don't think it's that complicated here. There are loads of random articles on this site attributed like this. Ones which would have no implication where someone would get in any trouble.

30

heimos OP t1_j28ozxs wrote

Replying to [deleted] (#1,178,598)

Kyiv Independent is a Russian news outlet ? You must be joking, right. This law essentially gives total media control to the government. Don’t forget there is election, yes despite the war, an election in 2023. So think what it will give ruling party

48

Snipgan t1_j28p4rd wrote

Typically the freedom of the press is very important and necessary for a freer society.

However, when faced with a literal war and a disinformation campaign by your enemies, it’s a tight rope to walk.

Not surprised more aggressive measures are being taken. The main hope is it will be walked back and relaxed when Ukraine finally kicks Russia’s butt out of their country.

5

Freexscsa t1_j28ryd2 wrote

Replying to heimos (#1,179,821)

I am going to go out on a limb and say chances are people are going to be pretty supportive of a government that's managing to fight off an invasion from a supposed super power.

21

heimos OP t1_j28t1b5 wrote

Replying to Freexscsa (#1,180,138)

Not doubting the support for the government. Doubting the fairness and freedom of choice for people and other parties. Media controls A LOT so that can be used as a tool to seat people’s opinion

13

BetaplanB t1_j28y5q6 wrote

Replying to [deleted] (#1,178,598)

Please provide sources that this article is directly or indirectly backed by Russia. Otherwise please adjust this seemingly false statement.

I am all in for throwing the Russian fascist propaganda out but you need to keep sane with yourself.

32

barrinmw t1_j28yjgw wrote

Replying to heimos (#1,179,821)

How do you have an election when you have parts of the country literally occupied by a foreign power? How do you have elections when your polling locations become targets for Russian missiles?

7

barrinmw t1_j2907y0 wrote

Replying to Wookhooves (#1,181,914)

He made a deal with separatist forces to fund them, if that is illegal, he will have his day in court. Are you going to claim that Zelensky is despotic because he acquiesced to the courts letting the former president go on his own recognizance?

Next you are going to tell me that if the DOJ goes after Trump, that is the US locking up political rivals too.

13

FapMeNot_Alt t1_j290uvs wrote

Replying to [deleted] (#1,178,598)

Several organizations quoted within this article are European or Ukrainian organizations. You can't just say "russia" and close your eyes to bad shit that happens, even if it is one of our allies doing it.

This law is needlessly broad and empowers the Ukrainian state to engage in prior restraint.

62

tehmlem t1_j291dd1 wrote

Folks, supporting Ukraine's right to sovereignty and self governance does not mean any criticism of policy means you must be Russian. Likewise "they're fighting a war" is not carte blanche for actions that would otherwise be dangerous and unjust.

See Korematsu v United States, Debs v United States

89

s0mnambulance t1_j292kxm wrote

Replying to 9Wind (#1,177,942)

Yes they could, and that may be a problem down the line. This is another of the many, many, many shitty things about war-- you can't afford to think ethically in the long-term, even if you're being invaded. With social media being used for what I'll go as far as to call mass brainwashing, and Russia having embraced this tactic, their enemies may very well have to restrict media/freedom of speech to keep the enemy from using it to their advantage.

Humans are such shit animals. It really bothers me that we still tend to do this 'good guys/bad guys' thing when actual war breaks out, as though life were a simple fable. War IRL is the erosion of everything that makes us human, on any and every side. Russia is 100% the aggressor here, but that means Ukraine has to be vicious and conniving in response. If Ukraine doesn't flex against said aggression, where does that lead them?

−10

Wookhooves t1_j292xv1 wrote

Replying to barrinmw (#1,182,129)

I’m saying the charges he’s claiming don’t seem to be true. It was the courts decision not to pursue charges at this time… the accusations don’t have substance behind them.

1

astral1 t1_j293jnl wrote

You can tell when this man talks that he is full of something. He looks and acts like a paid actor. Something is fishy over in Ukraine. They just fought hard internally for democratic society. (doc: winter onfire? )

−20

Showerthawts t1_j294mbx wrote

Abraham Lincoln suspended habeas corpus during the civil war.

13

mrlolloran t1_j295jpx wrote

Replying to Konras (#1,183,507)

So nobody who founded it or working there can have opinions from before the paper was founded?

Edit: people downvoting me are smooth brained af. That’s like saying I couldn’t have an opinion or stance on 9/11 if I started a newspaper next week because it already happened.

−14

DM_DM_DND t1_j299ze7 wrote

Before anyone loses their shit: The EFJ criticized this back in July. It's been months since then and it's gone through revisions. I don't speak Ukrainian so I can't personally verify what the bill actually says now, but my understanding was that the bill was criticized for granting too much power over non-traditional media like websites. Most of the Ukrainian sites I'm reading are saying that it's primarily focused on providing more control over traditional media broadcasting in it's current form. Unless a local or Ukrainian speaker confirms that it has been relatively unaltered a lot of the speculation in the comments section is misguided.

The other aspect is that, to be frank, Journalists always argue for no regulation of Journalists. They are biased here by circumstance and creed, and as an American I have a very strong belief that they can't be trusted to represent themselves fairly in this matter. Misinformation thrives because the new Media cycle is broken, and special interests have been allowed to purchase and control Media with impunity. Yes, government regulation is an imperfect solution, but unregulated journalism is a disease.

29

Dvoraxx t1_j29lzwb wrote

Replying to Outrageous_Garlic306 (#1,187,350)

My point is that people are very quick to dismiss anything remotely negative about Ukraine as Russian propaganda

The comment I replied to didn’t even say it was fake. They literally said “people who are aligned with Russia say it’s bad, therefore it must be good” and tried to imply the Kyiv Independent is under Russian control

47

Zachf1986 t1_j29pand wrote

Replying to tehmlem (#1,182,430)

No, but it's not unreasonable to want to control the media in a period of wartime, and with the modern rise of the use of propaganda and misinformation as a primary tool for authoritarians.

I'd want to keep an eye on it, but it doesn't really mean that it will be used to limit freedom of the press. I would think it unlikely due to their desire to maintain positive relations with NATO countries and the EU. Abusing it would undermine those goals.

−10

WolfThick t1_j29vryf wrote

Russian fanboys sticking up for Russia huh who are these objections coming from let me guess

−9

elefantsblue t1_j29ygqr wrote

Of course they want authoritarian control like they have in the EU.

−13

Disenculture t1_j2a8k4t wrote

100% will be abused. Not even a fucking question.

12

dudeinred69 t1_j2ad51b wrote

Replying to Zachf1986 (#1,188,373)

Ultimately media freedom is necessary to actually allow the people to express their will

I wouldn’t be too confident about him winning support in the next election, especially if some other candidate proposes a peace treaty that stops all the death and misery

This new law favours him massively and it is not a democratic thing

−12

Anonuser123abc t1_j2akm8l wrote

Replying to ucjuicy (#1,179,063)

One thing being bad doesn't make a different bad thing good. Your comment is the text book argument from hypocrisy (whataboutism). The two things are separate and different and also both bad.

1

fartalldaylong t1_j2ayp1h wrote

Replying to dudeinred69 (#1,194,169)

The laws in the previous government were flat out authoritarian. This is nothing more than creating laws to protect against insurgence and misinformation from Russia...which I am sure you are well aware.

Tell me about the media laws in Russia and the freedom of the press there...go on...

3

Showerthawts t1_j2b1chz wrote

Replying to OnePlus4Equalsfun (#1,196,958)

The office of Executive really only exists for one purpose in modern Democracy - and that is to make quick decisions in wartime. If our nation thought it was so wrong then, why didn't we reform the law afterwards? Marshall Law also allows for basically total control by the President as Commander in Chief. No?

1

astral1 t1_j2bjbr9 wrote

Replying to TraditionalGap1 (#1,187,920)

because i dont trust Zelensky and for all we know this could all be a pretense for taking ukraine out of the EU , supplant their democracy, or something... i got a lot of ideas based on things ive gleaned so idk. im dumb so idk. im just trying to think ok. Please donthurt mah feelings. You can CALL it a democracy when you contorl the media.

−9

heimos OP t1_j2bnmhf wrote

Replying to Blitzdrive (#1,200,720)

There is absolutely nothing positive in invading a sovereign country. Between lives lost and ethnic damage between two nations, the pain from this conflict will last for years. With that being said, you have to zoom out and look at the bigger picture of has happened in the last 30 years between the West and Russia

−11

VentusHermetis t1_j2bw4g5 wrote

Replying to DM_DM_DND (#1,184,714)

> Unless a local or Ukrainian speaker confirms that it has been relatively unaltered a lot of the speculation in the comments section is misguided.

No. The burden of proof is on those who claim the law is different than that which has been confirmed, even if that confirmation was months ago.

−2

DM_DM_DND t1_j2bwvd5 wrote

Replying to VentusHermetis (#1,207,984)

...I mean, no it's not. The expectation is that laws change from their draft forms. That's just how politics work.

Using a months old condemnation without context for if it's still relevant is dumb as a bag of bricks. You don't get to ignore questions of relevancy by arguing that a controversy is eternally relevant somehow. Plus this isn't an impossible question to answer, I just don't have any easy way to answer it myself.

6

react_dev t1_j2cpbic wrote

Replying to barrinmw (#1,181,633)

Traitors can be a label that’s easily applied to… guess who, your political opponents.

I mean who knows the truth. Not me. I’m not gonna guess what I don’t know

5

heimos OP t1_j2ebumj wrote

Replying to shewy92 (#1,231,080)

Remember when Putin and Biden met, guess what they talked about. They couldn’t agree on something, and we could only guess what. Result of that was the invasion.

−8