I think it will eventually. But the big difference versus neighborhoods like fishtown, brewerytown, point breeze etc is that there's not a lot of large vacant lots, so it's pretty dependent on people flipping homes/smaller apartment buildings. There's unfortunately not many places where you can put those massive projects that you see in those aforementioned neighborhoods

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There’s a bar there on that corner that is really bad and has been for a long time.

8th and Jackson isn’t even even that bad, this is just Philly in general. Walk two blocks this way you could get shot, walk two blocks the other way it’s nice.

8th and Jackson is below Snyder Ave. Snyder is a big dividing line.

The area around 7th street is and will continue to be a center of crime.

I dunno man, I see shit happening north of Snyder but south of Passyunk too. Maybe slightly worse on the south side but there’s just general shittiness happening around that area.

This. A single large apartment building can mean an influx of several hundred new residents, all more or less at once. That in turn will draw in others who see positive change in the neighborhood, in addition to businesses to serve all those people.

T Barr is just a shithole bar that consistently causes trouble.

Edit:

Google Review...

5 Stars

"My dad was killed here but it's still family"

tells you all you need to know

It actually looks like it’s up a block or so at Winton but yea T-Barr’s being shitty seems to be a common sentiment.

Isn't T-Barr's out of business?

Citizen comments refer to a group that stands around on one of the corners there. I really wish there was a way to effectively clear corners. Practically every shooting video the PPD posts when looking for tips/information is a group getting walked down in broad daylight while standing around on a corner somewhere. I get that at least some of these are drug crews but why the fuck would you hang around in the open if you have "opps" looking to spray dozens of bullets in your direction? Sell drugs indoors for fuckssake

I live near where this happened. There are drug dealers that popped up in like August/September 2022 on the corner of 8th and Winton. I sent Squilla an email late last year saying this is happening and they’re making the neighborhood worse. Got the hand-waving of “we are increasing patrols.” The city has not increased patrols, obviously. The dealers on that corner are making the area much worse, and there is literally nothing being done about it.

Definitely. I live in the area (by Dickinson Square Park), and the farther west and south you go, the worse it is until you hit Passyunk.

I mean, shit, 6th between Tasker and Dickinson is one of the dirtiest blocks around.

When was the shooting on Jackson? Today?

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It was at 8th and Winton, but yea, today. Right before I posted this.

Damn, I was wondering what that noise was.

Once Pennsport, Passyunk, and LoMo get too expensive for yuppies. It's already happening -- I couldn't find another place to rent in Passyunk within my budget even though I loved the area, so I moved to Point Breeze.

Greatest review of any bar I've ever read.

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> Sell drugs indoors for fuckssake

yeah but that's boring when you can be out on the wire

i know it is cliche but "it gets worse before it gets better" in this case. specifically, when there was no development in those neighborhoods, crime was spread out. now, they're all going to the same spots, fewer opportunities, more turf disagreements.

if you're looking to invest, 18 shots means you'll still get a good deal.

You’re delusional if you think development stops crime and shootings.

Drinks must be on point if they’re worth dealing with all that emotional trauma for.

The PHDC and UPenn did a study that identified a relationship between improving homes and a reduction in neighborhood crime, so there's that! Article here: https://whyy.org/articles/how-fixing-leaky-roofs-reduced-crime-in-philly-neighborhoods/

Maybe not so much with market-rate housing, but affordable housing development and/or city-funded repair programs to existing homes does have an effect on crime. This was identified in a UPenn study with the PHDC: https://whyy.org/articles/how-fixing-leaky-roofs-reduced-crime-in-philly-neighborhoods/

Yes I was speaking about the former and I do support the latter.

The guy who runs the community group (7th st community council) in that area, Bruce Baldwin, is a corrupt asshat who fights any sort of development or improvements in the area unless the proper bribes are paid. It’s the worst RCO I’ve ever had the misfortune of working with because of him. He is doing real harm to that area that could easily become a thriving community with a bit of investment and some real policing and code enforcement.

The guy who runs the community group for that area won’t let people improve properties without first bribing him and also being the right race. He is openly anti Asian and makes it clear that are not welcome in his neighborhood. Bruce Baldwin is probably in my top 5 most hated people in Philly for being a corrupt racist.

The guy who runs the community group (7th st community council) in that area, Bruce Baldwin, is a corrupt racist asshat who fights any sort of development or improvements in the area unless the proper bribes are paid and the applicants are of the right race (not Hispanic or Asian) It’s the worst RCO I’ve ever had the misfortune of working with because of him. He is doing real harm to that area that could easily become a thriving community with a bit of investment and some real policing and code enforcement.

In a guess....eventually, but we're talking 8+ years out. It's going to take a major player to move in to make something happen. That area is rough.

Edit to add: I grew up in East Passyunk in the 90s/2000s. It's always been shady, but has been extremely so in the last decade or so. My analysis is based on a few things. I was looking to buy a house and had been out of the area a few years, so figured why not. Every property needed extensive work. Like absolute gut jobs. I visited two properties that had been worked on - both had been broken into. The first was trashed, the second we didn't investigate because it was clear someone was already in the building with us and we noped out. The level of dilapidation there coupled with poverty makes it hard to maintain these properties, and the safety issues are a deterrent as well, especially when there are safer areas to move to that aren't ridonkulously overpriced. It's gonna be one of the last sections of South Philly to see change.

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