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SoylentRox t1_j5sisg3 wrote

Reply to comment by Sigma_Atheist in This subreddit has seen the largest increase of users in the last 2 months, gaining nearly 30k people since the end of November by _dekappatated

I know. Don't forget "they will exclusively hoard anti-aging for themselves". (Ignoring the reality that governments and health insurance companies have more money than all billionaires combined, and they have to pay a fortune because everything in a person breaks as aging slowly wrecks everything and they become unable to work)

Or "we would be so overpopulated life would suck". Nevermind that governments could require aging clinics to make their clients infertile. You would need a license to have an additional child after your normal reproductive lifetime.

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Cult_of_Chad t1_j5t3lhz wrote

>Or "we would be so overpopulated life would suck". Nevermind that governments could require aging clinics to make their clients infertile. You would need a license to have an additional child after your normal reproductive lifetime.

If the government tries to restrict my fertility in exchange for subsidizing life extension I'll just make use of medical tourism for either life extension or reproduction. Poor people that can afford to fly out to breed or access enhancement therapies would be the only ones these laws apply to.

The answer to a growing population is to continue industrializing the solar system. There's enough resources for trillions of us.

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SoylentRox t1_j5u8k92 wrote

I mean medical tourism might not have access to the best stuff. Today this is true, it's just that the best medicine is not much more effective than cheaper simpler stuff. (Mainly because there are no treatments for aging or treatments that grow you spare parts and transplant them)

Once it's a matter of very complex treatments you may see huge differences. As in, the good clinics have almost 100 percent 10 year survival rates and the bad have 50.

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Cult_of_Chad t1_j5ug1oj wrote

You're the one assuming that:

  1. Therapies will be complex
  2. Expensive clinics around the world would have poorer access
  3. Any liberal democracy would force people to get sterilized to access life-saving medicine.

It's a dystopic masturbatory fantasy with no basis in reality and no need to boot. Why the hell would we want to slow down population growth while going through a catastrophic demographic collapse? Our birthrates are so bad that biological immortality would barely make a dent.

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SoylentRox t1_j5uh3ns wrote

  1. This is obvious and there is a risk of malware, etc. You understand that this isn't like taking metformin, it's probably massive surgery to remove old joints and skin and possibly just your whole body except for your brain and spine. Aging does some physical damage that won't heal.

After the many surgeries you have permanent implants and sensors installed that have to interface to local clinics and a network of ambulances etc. And you have to return for checkups and repairs periodically.

  1. This is how that works now, also it's an ongoing process. You don't really get cured of aging just the condition managed

  2. They might if it results in severe overpopulation

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Cult_of_Chad t1_j5uiata wrote

>1. Aging does some physical damage that won't heal.

You literally can't know this.

>2. They might if it results in severe overpopulation

Overpopulation is a factor of carrying capacity and we're currently very far from any kind of Malthusian limit. Also, there's actually been research done on this so there's no need for speculation.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3192186/

You're being needlessly doomish.

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SoylentRox t1_j5uio8h wrote

What do you mean I "can't know this". You know how sports stars need surgeries when they wear out a joint or break a tendon, an injury that won't heal?

That's not even aging it can happen in your 20s. Treatments for aging alone at best restore your ability to heal from your early 20s.

If you are 80 years old and at a patient at the clinic lots of stuff will be damaged.

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Cult_of_Chad t1_j5uj4h4 wrote

We could literally have organic nanobots capable of repairing every tissue in the body within the decade. The future is hard to predict under normal circumstances and we're far, far from that now.

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SoylentRox t1_j5ukccw wrote

How do the nanobots coordinate? Where do they get the replacement cells? How do they cut away a broken limb? What do they do with waste?

Stay plausible. Nanobots that magically heal injuries are more like stage magic.

A more plausible version: new organs or whole body subsections grown and built in the lab. Layer by layer, with inspections and functional tests. So the lab is certain each part is well made.

And then the "nanobots" are basically hacked human cells that go on the interfaces where there would be a scar otherwise. They on command will glue themselves to nearby cells and do a better job of healing than what would otherwise just be 2 human tissues held together with thread. So the patient can walk right after surgery because all the places their circulatory system and skin and so on were spliced is as strong as their normal tissue and doesn't hurt.

They also bridge nerve connections.

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Cult_of_Chad t1_j5umqbq wrote

>Stay plausible.

I don't believe you're important enough to be this arrogant.

How about we wait until the end of the century and see what happens? We have absolutely no idea what the AI revolution will reveal in terms of unknown unknowns. If you believe you're in a better position than me to predict the future you're either very well connected or delusional.

Also, please address my criticism of your unnecessary doomerism and re population growth.

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SoylentRox t1_j5uo8v5 wrote

It's not doomerism to think that rich countries will get richer and have better access to tech.

That is literally a statement of past history.

Population growth: sure. I already said rich countries have declining pops so letting rejuvenated people have kids is what they would do at first.

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Cult_of_Chad t1_j5uor2i wrote

>It's not doomerism to think that rich countries will get richer and have better access to tech.

Not every rich country will have the same legal approach to transformative technology. Also, wealth inequality means that the wealthy in middle income countries have access to western-level technology.

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SoylentRox t1_j5urx2v wrote

Sure. One idea I have had is :

  1. Megacorps develop very capable AGI tools and let others see them

  2. Have billionaire friends, get startup money

  3. Use the AGI tools to automate mass biomedical research

  4. Once the AGI system understands biology well, give challenge tasks to grow human organs or keep small test animals alive. Most tasks are simulated but some are real.

  5. Open up a massive hospital in a poor jurisdiction with explicit permission to do any medical treatment the AGI wants as long as the result are good.

  6. Some kind of Blockchain accountability, where patients before applying to go to your hospital register and get examined first and the conventional medical establishment writes down their current age and expected lifespan and terminal diagnosis. Then after treatment they return and get examined again. Blockchain is just so history can't be denied or altered.

  7. Payments are on success. Waitlist order is based partially on payment bid. Reinvest all profits to expand capacity and capabilities

  8. Use your overwhelming evidence of success to lobby western governments to ban non AI medicine and to revoke drug patents. (Because there is no value in pharma patents if an AI can invent a new drug in seconds. To an AI, molecules are as easy to use as we find hand tools and it can just design one to fit any target.)

  9. The owners of the clinic would be trillionaires. It's the most valuable product on earth

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Cult_of_Chad t1_j5utok4 wrote

Or literally none of that will happen. Do you just sit around imagining increasingly more bizarre and convoluted ways rich people bad? Get a grip. Your inane speculation has so many moving parts it might as well be a ferris wheel.

Somehow you've taken the very credible concept of AI-driven existential risk and reduced it to a ridiculous conspiracy where AGI cooperates with a global cabal of Disney villains to do something untenable and pointless.

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SoylentRox t1_j5uxce7 wrote

Lol. Hope you live long enough to get neural implants so you can read better. Or you can ask chatGPT to summarize for you.

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TheOGCrackSniffer t1_j5sz6o9 wrote

hahahahahaha, funniest thing i ever heard, a license for what's arguably a human right

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Air_Holy t1_j5szxrg wrote

Would living waaaaay longer than natural unmodified biology allows you to be considered a human right ?

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sumane12 t1_j5taf4k wrote

Yes, but only when you consider the alternative.

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