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Mewhenthe4 OP t1_j6e2bbj wrote

This is a repost because the link I gave before was bad.

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Doormatty t1_j6e2esk wrote

You realize they’re not counting surface water right in that list right? No other measurement of area does that.

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samfreez t1_j6e8unq wrote

Land area is a terrible determination of size, because Canada has thousands and thousands of lakes and other bodies of water, many more than the US or China..

This basically shows why stats can be meaningless if you add enough caveats.

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GetsGold t1_j6e9gq3 wrote

It's not meaningless. It's just another measurement. It doesn't mean China is actually bigger than these two countries, it's just saying they have more land area. That's still an interesting piece of information.

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rbhxzx t1_j6egah4 wrote

you don't know what a straw man is lol. he's being an idiot, just tell him that. you don't have to try to use terms you don't understand to dunk on his ""argument"" as if he or us were even having one.

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mnfimo t1_j6ejr6i wrote

This comment section is intense

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Tulol t1_j6eutr4 wrote

China has a giant Gobie desert that’s not useable.

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iamnotthelizardqueen t1_j6ev8zx wrote

So what you’re saying is that with enough caveats, the United States is the largest biggest girthiest county

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AdRepulsive7699 t1_j6ewifv wrote

With all that’s going on here I believe it should go to r/shittymapporn

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Bruce-7891 t1_j6ewkpp wrote

True, with enough effort and resources space is habitable, but there are places where no one would permanently settle. In the US I think of parts of the Mojave desert and in China parts of the Himalayas

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traws06 t1_j6exetv wrote

Would they really be more inhabitable than northern Canada? Not rhetorical I’m not versed in geography to that degree. In my mind even a desert has water if you drill deep enough.

Hell, there are thriving cities in deserts in the Middle East

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I_FIGHT_BEAR t1_j6ezzkf wrote

Yeah there’s plenty of other criteria that can be used to justify how big a country is. Population is one, even better might be ‘persons per square mile’ if you’re talking about a place like Russia where the landmass is huge but the populations are centered to specific regions

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pennysmom2016 t1_j6f18yk wrote

Because most people consider the inland water area of a nation as part of that nation's area. By not explicitly stating that you are excluding that area, you are presenting intentionally misleading information.

0

monotrememories t1_j6f75rn wrote

I can’t believe someone just learned this today

−7

Consistent_Ad_4828 t1_j6fafh9 wrote

Lol yeah I assume so, hence me being downvoted already. Try praising anything about China on a non-political issue (working to prevent the desertification of areas near the Gobi, tech innovations) and you’ll get a bunch of what I assume are bots calling you an authoritarian lol. Nuance seems to instantly be lost on people.

−26

W_O_M_B_A_T t1_j6fqr3r wrote

You mean those maps of north America LIED to me?

0

IndraBlue t1_j6frywp wrote

What are they teaching in schools now if you learned this today ?

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castortusk t1_j6fzbza wrote

Did you know Switzerland is larger than Russia? (only measuring land area that is an Alp)

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e_spider t1_j6g264l wrote

So the above map should not have 3/4 on China and US. The US should always be 3 and China and Canada should have 2/4 on their ranking.

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GetsGold t1_j6gb89y wrote

The paradox doesn't depend on continuously zooming, the problem is that the length changes depending on the accuracy of your measurement or how much you zoom. So you could choose a string, and choose how sharply to bend that string around the border, but that's arbitrary. Why not a thinner string with a smaller scale of tracing, or a thicker rope with less sharp tracing?

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Daniel_The_Thinker t1_j6gh1cp wrote

In a technical sense there are very few places that are truly uninhabitable.

In a practical sense, there are many pieces where humans cannot create survive in without a nomadic lifestyle or a steady supply of resources necessary for survival.

Low earth orbit is not really habitable for human beings despite some people temporarily living up there

−4

Daniel_The_Thinker t1_j6ghn83 wrote

Not all deserts are made equal.

There's a huge difference between the Mojave, which had permanent settlement by native Americans, and the Sahara, which has massive areas with no vegetation or rainfall.

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traws06 t1_j6giez1 wrote

It could be inhabitable at least with a pipeline for water I would imagine? It just wouldn’t self sufficient.

Cold it seems would cause more issues than heat. Cold causes issues with machines, fuel, and other stuff necessary for survival.

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-Bob_Frapples t1_j6gj51s wrote

There are also more people in California than all of Canada.

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GetsGold t1_j6gpqde wrote

Whether you use kilometers or miles doesn't change the end result. It's still the same length regardless of units. But choosing how accurately you measure the border does change the result, and the accuracy you choose is arbitrary.

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GetsGold t1_j6gpyqr wrote

You're comparing with the same size string, but the size you use is arbitrary and you will get different comparisons depending on the choice. With one choice, one country might have a larger border, with another, another might. And look how many complaints there are in this thread just because China has a bigger land area. Now imagine if there is one string that would give China a bigger border and one which gives the US a bigger one. Then China would just choose the measurement which makes them bigger and US the other.

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Alternative-Flan2869 t1_j6gsakl wrote

That is such an American post. Geography and foreign languages are American achilles heels.

−6

Ok-disaster2022 t1_j6gsyea wrote

Does dick measuring surface area matter in the scheme of things? Farm able land seems more important.

−6

moonlightpeas t1_j6gt2mt wrote

Have you tried seeing how big china is if you take Taiwan away?

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kumquat_repub t1_j6guilm wrote

The lengths of coastlines cannot be measured absolutely, but they can be compared…relative to one another. You just have to use the same measuring standard on each one for a comparative measurement.

1

GetsGold t1_j6gvkbv wrote

But whatever comparison method you choose is going to be arbitrary. What if one method makes the US longer while another makes China longer? Then you're going to have the same drama as in this comment section over which to use.

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kumquat_repub t1_j6gwms9 wrote

Yes whatever comparison method you choose will be arbitrary, but the smaller the scale of the measurements, the more accurate it becomes to find relative coastline lengths.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_length_of_coastline?wprov=sfti1

This Wikipedia article begins by explaining the coastline paradox but then states the measurements were taken at 1:250,000 scale. There are GIS tools that can calculate the lengths of coastline at this scale and add them up, giving you a very accurate relative list of coastlines…the key word is relative.

−1

GetsGold t1_j6gwx9p wrote

That doesn't seem to match what the article is saying:

>The smaller the scale interval (meaning the more detailed the measurement), the longer the coastline will be.

It doesn't make it more accurate, it just makes it longer.

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Hydra57 t1_j6gxdgg wrote

A while ago I learned Spain was bigger than France, and both were bigger than Germany. The mercator projection was deceiving me.

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kumquat_repub t1_j6gxdkw wrote

Yes they will get longer…all of them will, but they will remain proportional to each other. The US has roughly 4.4 times as much coastline as China. If you make the scale interval smaller, they will both increase in length but the ratio will remain roughly 4.4:1

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GetsGold t1_j6hdbwa wrote

In other cases, like with area, the actual area doesn't change, just you estimation of it.

With border length however, there is no "actual" length, as the more accurate you measure it, the length will increase and not ever get closer and closer to some specific value.

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WellyKiwi t1_j6hek1i wrote

Are they measuring all the crinkly bits though?

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torsun_bryan t1_j6hq1fe wrote

lol — what a sad state the American education system is in now

−1

dracoryn t1_j6i5s7u wrote

Not meaningless, just depends what meaning you get. Say you wanted to filter to "habitable" square milage? You might filter out bodies of water, mountains, areas that get almost no rain, etc.

It is only arbitrary if you aren't intentional with filtering.

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Rattus375 t1_j6i8mm0 wrote

This is very interesting. I knew Canada had far more lakes in it relative to the US, but I never would have guessed it was to the degree that would make the US the bigger country by land area. Why so many people are upset by a fun fact I will never understand

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pzerr t1_j6iahp1 wrote

Land with lakes are far more valuable and useful than land alone and can sustain far far more people.

You want bodies of water to make land useful. Particular in that there is no lack of land in North America.

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Rattus375 t1_j6id7k0 wrote

Well that's just a moronic take that's just trying to be divisive for no good reason. Objectively, canada has far less useful and valuable land than the US does. There's a reason the majority of the population lives right on the border. Having more lakes isn't inherently good or bad as long as it doesn't tend too far towards either extreme and this says absolutely nothing about the countries listed other than their land area

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redstonebrain40 t1_j6iyi49 wrote

I'm mean, China sucks. America sucks. Material facts of a country aren't affected. If kinda bigger, China bigger. Look im canadian so I have the worst leg to loose anyways. Eat ur syrup and like it bots.

3

I_FIGHT_BEAR t1_j6iz099 wrote

Yup. I’m from California, one of the oft-repeated ‘facts’ we bring up is that our state population is higher than Canada’s, which still to this day blows my goddamn mind. And if I’m honest, makes me want to move to Canada so I can fucking BREATHE

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Mewhenthe4 OP t1_j6izv33 wrote

Why do people say this acting like they're so smart? This isn't even learned in school because the total area is used over land area, the only reason a teacher might tell you that is because interesting to know. You're blatantly lying.

1

LassitudinalPosition t1_j6j0pfk wrote

Having a lot of land area and not a lot of water seems like a not great thing!

1

enterthewoods1 t1_j6j1k7j wrote

Lmao you don’t need to try be snarky it’s not gonna further any kind of discussion.

Do you have this same opinion of Chinese social media and mainstream media? Because it’s just as feverish if not worse.

You’re basically telling all of humanity to grow up, most people won’t, this is how geopolitics goes for the majority of a population.

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enterthewoods1 t1_j6j1zjs wrote

Lol ur probably getting downvoted because you come off pretentious and snarky and people don’t like that.

You’re literally calling people animals, if you don’t want discussion fine but don’t be surprised when people dislike you with no discussion if that’s your stance, maybe you need to grow up.

Also I literally am discussing with you and you’re waving it off, by your own definition aren’t you an “animal” too?

1

Responsible_Smile789 t1_j6kl8k1 wrote

“according to older versions of the CIA World Factbook (from 1982 to 1996), the U.S. was listed as the world's fourth-largest country (after Russia, Canada, and China) with a total area of 9,372,610 km2. However, in the 1997 edition, the U.S. added coastal waters to its total area (increasing it to 9,629,091 km2). And then again in 2007, the U.S. added territorial water to its total area (increasing it to 9,833,517 km2). During this time, China's total area remained unchanged. In other words, no coastal or territorial water area was added to China's total area figure.”

-From the source of the rankings(Britannica, United Nations)

So basically in the US we acknowledged China was bigger until 1997 then decided to count 100 miles of water off our entire coast to boost our stats. Hawaii too and I bet we even counted Puerto Rico to boost our stats even though we won’t allow territories to become actual states and get the benefits. Which isn’t a big deal but it is a lil lets wave our dick in the wind uncle sam type of thing.

0

Mewhenthe4 OP t1_j6l15hy wrote

What does that have to do with anything? How do I know how they calculate it?

Use your brain.

Edit: Also, you even just said that the lake level drops, not fully dries up. So nothing would change even if the lake levels dropped since there is still water there.

−3

Mewhenthe4 OP t1_j6lf7d9 wrote

So since some geniuses keep making dumb responses to the post, I’ll answer the questions here.

  1. When it says LAND area it means SURFACE LAND AREA. I didn’t think I would have to specify since it’s obvious.

  2. No it’s not common knowledge, neither Is it regularly taught in schools like some people are claiming.

  3. I didn’t do the measurements. So stop asking me “what ifs”.

  4. Land area is not that specific of a measurement, so talking about how it’s too specific doesn’t really apply here.

0

Equivalent_Bunch_187 t1_j6mlgzo wrote

If you only count the surface area resembling a boot, Italy is the largest country in the world.

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RaiShado t1_j6mpzqf wrote

No, that's not what they are saying, if you had received a proper education you would be able to see that at the very highest the US is second in land area, followed by Canada and led by China, simply from the title. However, you decided to not read the title nor the information in the webpage linked to and just hate on the US.

Take your hate elsewhere.

−1

RaiShado t1_j6obt2u wrote

aTTacK tHe aRgumENt NOT ThE pErson

Thank you, you have let me rule out the complete idiot part and I can now classify you as just a gigantic festering asshole.

You had ZERO argument to attack, you were trying to use sarcasm to hate on Americans just because you think it's fun to hate on Americans.

And now, after you get called out on it, you are playing the victim. Just STFU and, like I said before, take your hate elsewhere.

Also, just so you know, largest and biggest are also not units of measure. But all three, including girth, can be measured, the units would vary depending on what was being measured, and in the case of land area it would be square kilometers or square miles. Although largest and biggest are synonyms so it's the same either way. Girth wouldn't be measured in this instance as it is another term for circumference or perimeter.

−1

samfreez t1_j6p3s6x wrote

It would be interesting to see the real numbers there, because a lot of big cities have "reclaimed" massive tracts of land from the oceans they butt up against, in addition to things like docks and piers and things deliberately built over top of otherwise open water.

Then there are house boats and whatnot, and even entire towns in some countries (SE Asia has more than a couple floating towns IIRC, though I don't remember where exactly)

Edit: I also don't count a city/town built at the base of a mountain, because that's just normal land. I'm talking more about the inaccessible peaks themselves. Some countries like China do that a lot more often than you see in, for example, the US, but I suspect most of that would be a wash overall.

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