worldtravelstephanie

worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j4mrwjj wrote

I hope you get to experience it as well then!

There are disputes more frequently than crimes as far as I experienced, it’s not a Utopia by any means and humans are humans after all! In Siberia their justice system is divided by gender, so I never saw how the men held ‘court’. However, if two people could not come to an agreement, or a taboo was broken, the elders hold ‘court’. Depending on the seriousness more of the community becomes involved. I never witnessed anything serious. Amongst the Kazakhs I never experienced any crimes and only a minor dispute, so I can’t say much to it. It was very family centric, so issues usually went to the oldest grandfather. When I first got there however, from what I can tell, they were at the end of a lengthy crime by an uncle. A crime I think was pertaining to opium and mishandling the families goat herd (he lost some or traded it for opium? I came in as he was leaving). However the decision was made, I know multiple families were involved and ultimately they forced him to leave with nothing and his wife stayed in the family with her kids.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3z9ypi wrote

So, that depends on your definition of “civilization” because there are little trading outposts and even villages that don’t have roads but you can get to by off road/4x4 vehicles and snow mobile, those are obviously closer than cities with “modern services”. I’ll try to summarize and hope it answers your question!

-In Russia, essentially, Irkutsk (pop 600,000ish?) is the closest “city/modern services” (even though Irkutsk is not in Siberia I had to go through there due to weird visa/permit reasons, though there are a few cities of this size all about the same distance away). As the crow flies that’s about 1,100mi/1,770km away from where the nomadic tribes are. After Irkutsk it’s only small villages without paved access or even smaller outposts. I went at the time of the migration to the winter grounds, which puts the herders going within roughly 100mi/160km of a trading outpost. That’s pretty much the closest they go. I got a snow mobile ride just over half that distance, and then had to ski the rest. That ski took 3 days, and on the 4th day I found them. On day 3 I knew I was close because I found sledge prints with reindeer prints in the snow.

-In Mongolia, from Ulaanbaatar I went to Olgii (pop 20-30,000?) which is arguably the closest “city/modern serve center” to the nomads I stayed with. As soon as we left the city center of UB we were off-roading. On maps there are roads, but they are not paved and not even grated (as of 2015). I got a smaller Jeep in Olgii toward the hillsides where I waited. The jeep ride was probably 80mi/130km as the crow flies, to where I was picked up via horse. I was picked up by the dad and his son-in-law, they had diverted probably 10mi/16km from where they were on their big seasonal migration route. That was easier than Siberia! I only waited for about 4hrs.

There were no real issues either time. Siberia was more worrisome for me. I didn’t know exactly my “goal” other than a very broad area (basically I was aiming for a lake they often travel by +/- 100km) and we were guessing based on the weather the prior month. So I was incredibly lucky, and had very good guidance from a local hunter/trader. By the time I got to Mongolia, I was like, ‘just wait on a hill and they find me?! Awesome!’

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3soyw0 wrote

Wow! Thanks, it was an experience for sure!

I still have a scar from the first time I held an eagle! So it was a rough start. My arms were also sore because they are heavy and move around a lot. When I finally got a juvenile to work with on my own, it starts with holding and feeding and getting the eagle used to humans and noises/other animals. In eagle training, while each person of age is chosen to take on the primary training, the eagle is expected to be able to hunt and follow the commands of whoever is working with it. So, when I left if had already been hunting with other people, and therefore while I certainly missed him, he was probably just fine. As majestic and epic as we find it, it is still a working animal to them. He went into the care of the other family members (the father took him) and they keep the eagle for hunting.

For more details you can read some of my other responses regarding how I got to find them in the first place, but as a whole I’ve found the nomadic groups I was with are very open people. Strangers are welcome and often seen as a blessing. Anyone who comes by is offered a place to stay and sleep and food to eat. That’s usually other nomadic people of course, but in a harsh environment where you wander, I think humanity wins most of the time and you just lend a helping hand and open your doors- “who knows when it will be you needing shelter/the work just needs to be done” kind of mentality. There was only one older uncle who never really appreciated me being there (in Mongolia) but we just got on with our days because the work still had to be completed.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3sl75t wrote

I’m not sure what you mean by drainage. Plumbing? No. Human waste goes in a hole dug in the ground for “number two”. “Number one” anywhere not near camp or the water. With the reindeer in winter you have to scare them off while you go, or they will try to lick up the salt.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3skhph wrote

Thank you for the “ “! It is tricky finding the wording to describe that way of life versus others! I knew I wasn’t going to stay forever, just to learn and help. For both people it just kinda came to a natural point where I’d either need to move on or become a full member of their society and stay. I was also a woman of a marriageable age, and didn’t want to go down that road because I didn’t want to stay forever. It was lovely but didn’t feel like home.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3sj5k5 wrote

That’s an intense question! Hope you don’t ever interview me for a job ;) I truly don’t believe there would be a consistent message. I think if I went back and asked, I’d get a different answer to give you from every person. The elders and those in Siberia have such a deep nature-shamanism connection that it would probably be something akin to honoring the earth and the spirit world. But, for many, I was just from ‘afar’. They asked about my family life, or how our house was, what animals I had. I think they imagined other people lived similarly to them, or in tiny villages they had seen, just in a different place. So the messages would all be probably related to that culture and their experiences.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3shk1j wrote

Wow, thank you!

I knew Siberian reindeer herders existed, and I knew Mongolia had nomads. I had read about them in National Geographic magazines and in a few atlas references. I started from there, and researched. Not google so much, this was around 2010 and books were still more prevalent 😆 I just worked a lot and saved a little, and never took PTO. Cashed it out when I left- they had to give me all the PTO hours earned at whatever my current pay rate was. Then put my stuff in a little storage unit (outside the city to get a better deal) and got a one way ticket.

Russia: I found vague hints at the reindeer herders and learned there were many regions and subgroups of them. I visited Russia once, made connections with traders (this was a very long process and I got scammed a few times), then came back when the season was better to meet up with them. Luckily one of the girls I met in a hostel helped me make sure it was all real. I was to help them with their big autumn migration in exchange for staying with them. I would also bring out supplies they wanted from the trader. It was meant to be just for the season, but the women agreed to let me stay after that. (Gender segregation, so mostly what happened to me was decided by the grandmothers)

Mongolia: I actually had a Mongolian woman in my university who became a good friend. Her brother-in-law was from a Kazakh goat herding family, and he left their nomadic family to move to the city. So she put me in touch with him. I stayed with his very distantly related cousins, his family didn’t need/want help but his cousins had just acquired another set of yaks and goats and wanted help. I could already horseback ride, and had herding experience, so they agreed I would help in exchange for room/board. No timeline was set, it was just more like ‘for a long time’.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3se3nn wrote

So, my findings are only speculation in Siberia because being in a place for a couple years doesn’t really give me a long term trend, but a lot of the reindeer herders were telling me they have had to change their routes, and more animals die in summer now. The bugs are so terrible, worse and worse every year, because the winters are not long or harsh enough to kill them off. We sometimes would have to go very far out of the way to find water, because snowmelt wouldn’t last as long as it used to. But in living where I do and spending over 10 years in the far north now, I’d say this is consistent with my overall experiences. The permafrost is melting which causes all sorts of problems, seasides collapse so the birds don’t nest, the ground is too soft and muddy so animals and trees are sinking. The insects don’t die off and cause real issues.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3sbg9r wrote

Note, I’m not a doctor! Both peoples seemed healthy. They were certainly active, even the elders. Both seemed happy, overall. There seemed to be more discontent amongst the younger Kazakh goat herders, but they also have more interaction with the outside world than those in Siberia. So perhaps it is just seeing that other options are out there. The Siberian nomads have lots of rules on cleanliness and washing and what touches what which has probably helped with managing germs or diseases. The Tavan Bogd nomads to a lesser extent. The only thing I was truly surprised about health wise was the state of their teeth. Not a lot of dental hygiene in either group and even young teens had rotten teeth (not a lot, but some). For not having sugar, this surprised me.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3sa35x wrote

Kazakh is a whole ethnic group of peoples, like ‘Mongolians’ or ‘Sami’ people. Some or nomadic, some are not. Some live in Kazakhstan, some in Russian or Mongolia, some in China, etc. Some have never herded at all and live in a city. Every person in an ethnic group does not do the same thing, or herd the same animals. I saw some that owned a lot of camels though I never stayed or interacted with those Kazakhs. I call them goat herders because the Kazakh group I stayed with had a few horses, but mostly yaks and goats.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3s8vp8 wrote

Both peoples have very different food than I was accustomed to, for sure. Not a lot of vegetables. In Siberia they eat a lot of raw meat, in Tavan Bogd they drink so much of this lard+milk+tea drink (it’s very thick and rich). I did partake of everything, as both groups are very pushy about eating. Sometimes it was hard, especially at first as my stomach took a while to adjust and my bathroom breaks were not fun. To this day there are certain foods that just the thought of makes me have a sour taste in my mouth (preserved/pickled duck) and my stomach never grew to like par boiled animal intestines. Both groups like them. But, I loved the dried bread of the Kazakh nomads, and they have certain animal meat that I ended up really loving and sometimes still crave.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3pzanh wrote

Haha! I’ll try to answer, but some thoughts are too abstract for words, and probably just sound chiche.

-why I visit different cultures: humans are really not so different from each other, at the end of the day we all laugh and cry and have drama and friends and to-do lists. We are all just trying to live. I don’t travel for the differences, though those are interesting and unique and fun. I find inspiration and beauty in the commonality of humanity.

-to live in remote places: I love nature. It makes me happy. So why not? When you are happy what could be considered a sacrifice seems more like a good trade.

-inspired me to be with nomadic peoples: I spent time skipping school at an early age and going to the library to look at maps and encyclopedias and old National Geographic magazines. I would look at mountains in the distance and wonder what living in them was like. I always had a love for the arctic and wild spaces. I felt trapped where I was and escaped by dreaming. When I finally had a chance to experience such a life, I just jumped in a little blindly, and found such a big world. I found it was even more amazing and breathtaking and real than my dreams. So the real moments replaced my dreams, and the big feelings that have heart-wrenching depth and no words took over and keep me going.

-to love nature: hmmm, no direct words. Perhaps because nature is bigger than the boundaries of language, bigger than me and my little feelings, it feels calm and pure. Harsh too, for sure. Anyone can loose a battle against nature, and I’ve got frostbite, scars, and known people who have died trying to make it in the elements. So that isn’t meant to be waxing poetic, I just can’t describe the calm, and it really puts life into perspective so one doesn’t fuss over the small stuff. Plus we wouldn’t exist without it, so I figure it deserves a certain amount of reverence.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3pxf7a wrote

So chemically I have no idea! But how you do it: when you slick your skin with the oil you use a special curved bone tool to massage it into your skin. Each person has their own. It seems to do two things, and you apply it twice in one ‘bath’. The first time it does pick up some dirt and sweat (not much sweat in those temperatures to be honest) and you kinda flick that oil off, not rub it in. Then, the next round you rub the oil in. It protects from wind and frost, and keeps your skin from drying out. It is very dry in winter in the arctic. There is almost no humidity and the snow is so dry you can’t make a snowball and when you come inside the snow on your clothes just evaporates, doesn’t even leave a puddle. I had a terrible time with my skin cracking and bleeding the first winter. My hands especially. The older women gave me a special fat that is mixed with some herbs to make more of a slave to help with that.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3pwdze wrote

  1. I left before winter in both cases, as winter was setting in (I had spent previous winters with them both and knew how it went). I’d have to leave before winter truly set in or I’d have to wait until spring, and better to let them have an extra winter ration. It seemed natural to help with moving to the wintering grounds and as the snow fell, it just felt time to go. It was hard, but I started to ache a little for familiar comforts, had grown up a lot, a didn’t feel the want to settle down with them.
  2. The shock of re-entry was harder than I expected! A big shock was hearing English all around me. I had gotten so accustomed to straining to pick up everything and grasping on to any word I understood and trying to understand that when I got to an English speaking airport my brain kept trying to understand -everything- and it hurt my ears and my head. I almost didn’t make my connection because I had gone somewhere quiet (a prayer room) to give myself a break! The other big shock was air quality. It probably wasn’t that smoky but I was coughing at everything and my nose was totally overwhelmed, I was convinced there must be a factory or fire near by.
  3. I did bring a tiny notepad/jotted stuff down, I’m not a big journal person so I tried to just write unique things I noticed or what I was worried I’d forget. I did take pictures! Lots. I had a point and shoot and a solar battery charger that back then was state-of-the-art. The Kazakhs thought it was fun to dress up and have me take a picture and then show them. I couldn’t print it, had no computer with me, they just looked at it on my camera over and over. So much so I had to over-dramatize the delicacy of the camera so they’d take a break. Even after months they loved it, when we met other nomads they had me show my camera.

And wow! Glad you find it interesting and I could answer questions you had!

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3puos6 wrote

Oh, that’s a tough question! Both cultures have amazing weavers. The Reindeer herders were very good at carving tiny pieces of ivory into spiritually important figures like foxes, wolves, and the polar bear. So detailed and maybe the size of my pinky (easy to carry on your person in honor of that spirit). The goat herders have huge weavings of complex spirals and curves in many many colors all made of yak hair that they line their beds and walls with to stay warm. But they are so detailed and tightly woven, and their fingers move so fast when they work.

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worldtravelstephanie OP t1_j3pu59a wrote

The Kazakhs are amazing archers! I was severely teased at my lack of skill. It is done from horseback often, the horses are still considered wild even though the nomads wrangle them, and as such they have a lot of free will and almost completely control your direction while you are shooting. You control the speed. I did get to practice (with kids only 10 or 12) but it is a skill mostly used for hunting in autumn, or ceremonially in summer at festivals. That’s when you see the tricks. Those are practiced when you have long days on horseback just herding the goats around. Groups of three or four herders will spend afternoons teasing, competing, and practicing while watching the goats. The most amazing trick I saw was when some young girls got really good at leaning back and spinning upside down, kinda leaning backward off the horse just being hooked on with one leg and shooting completely up-side-down. I did not try that, hah!

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